Re: CAA: Mutual Help List, Mutual Help List, "Gyroplanes, Etc."

[John Lawson <jlawson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

MARY HANSEN wrote:

> Got good info on ultralight policies.....concerning the over 254 pound crowd
> is our biggest problem......John........do you also look at registrations
> and licenses for your gryos ...

Good question.  No, we don't.  We only had one gyro around, and it went 
'crunch' into a nearby marsh...it hasn't been back up since.  But one thought 
occurs to me...it'd be kind of difficult to single out the gyro operators for
what would essentially be a "ramp check" to ensure that they are operating 
legally, without getting accused of "discriminating" against them...since they 
are aircraft just like anything else with an N number.  However, one way to
get around that...establish a policy that if your employees see an aircraft 
without an N number (anything from gyros to bizjets) that they have the 
authority to investigate further, and to call for LE/FSDO assistance if
necessary.   That might keep you out of trouble, since EVERYthing over 254 lbs 
(except the 2-seat "training" ultralights...they have their own weight 
limitation) has to have an N number on it.

> every problem we have had to date has been
> operators that do not have legal licenses and aircraft are not properly
> registered......we are considering having our gyro instructors do the
> document compliance and checkout of the gyro operators prior to any
> operations here at Yuba County and especially those that are renting
> hangars.....

That's a good idea.  Maybe require everyone (again, not just the gyro crowd) 
who rents hangar space OR ramp space to provide a valid and current copy of 
their pilots' license and aircraft registration, and to ensure a current one
is always on file?  If you have an FBO, perhaps require that they do this?

> FSDO is quite aware of our problems here..

Quite a sticky situation.  Good luck in sorting it out.  I'm sure the other 
denizens of the Help list would like to hear what happens. :-)

Semper Fi
John


>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: help-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:help-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of John Lawson
> Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2001 2:00 PM
> To: help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: CAA: Mutual Help List, Mutual Help List, "Gyroplanes, Etc."
>
> Amen to what Ted has said.  If it's operating under Part 91, getting the
> FSDO involved is the best way to go.
>
> At Beaufort County Airports, we require all ultralight operators to register
> with airport management and to have (and use) a radio to self-announce on
> CTAF.  When they register, we require that they show proof of registration
> and
> completion of a training course with a recognized ultralight organization
> (EAA, US Ultralight Assoc, etc).  We also require that their ultralight be
> registered with one of those organizations.
>
> Semper Fi
> John
>
> Ted Morris Jr wrote:
>
> > We have a municipal ordinance for the airport and here's what it says:
> >
> > 7.5-57(b) The following activities are permitted on the Airport only at
> > those times and in those areas designated for such purposes in writing by
> > the Airport manager.
> >
> >      (1) Activities subject to the regulation of FAR Part 101 (operation
> of
> > tethered or free balloons, kites, and unmanned rockets).
> >      (2) Activities subject to the regulation of FAR Part 103 (ultralight
> > aircraft operations).
> >      (3) Activities subject to the regulation of FAR part 105 (parachute
> > jumping) when the drop zone is on the Airport.
> >      (4) Any activity which involves towing an object into the air
> > (including banners and gliders).
> >      (5) Any activity which involves the dropping of objects from an
> > aircraft onto the Airport property.
> >      (6) Any activity which interrupts normal airport aviation activities
> > permitted by FAR Part 91 or required by FAR Part 139.
> >
> > Basically what I require is that they obtain and use the CTAF (we're a
> > non-towered field), and give way to all regular traffic.  The way I get
> them
> > to comply (besides a citation for violating the ordinance, which we
> haven't
> > had to do) is to say if they get in the way of a 'regular' airplane, that
> > pilot will call the FSDO and the FSDO will handle it, and then we'll just
> > ban them all from the airport.
> >
> > Of course we're small enough to get away with this sort of personal touch.
> >
> > The ABQ FSDO considers powered parachutes as ultralights under part 103.
> >
> > However, gyrocopters are aircraft subject to part 91.  If you're having
> > problems with them not adhereing to part 91, call the FSDO.
> >
> > And in case anybody wants to know, yes, we do have unmanned rocket flight
> > requests pretty often (there's several serious clubs in town because of
> > NMSU, the NASA site & White Sands Missile Range.
> >
> > Ted Morris
> > Airport Manager
> > Las Cruces International Airport
> > Las Cruces, New Mexico, USA
> > airport@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > http://www.las-cruces.org/airport
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Stephen Irwin [mailto:stepheni@xxxxxxxxx]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2001 12:27 PM
> > > To: help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Subject: CAA: Mutual Help List, "Gyroplanes, Etc."
> > >
> > >
> > > Does anyone have any specific rules and procedures that apply
> > > to gyroplanes,
> > > gyrocopters, powered parachutes, and ultralights....Yuba
> > > County Airport is
> > > in the process of putting together some rules as a result of
> > > several gyro
> > > crashes . . . would like to see what may already be in place
> > > and be glad to
> > > share what procedures we establish.
> > >
> > > Mary Hansen
> > > Email: mhansen@xxxxxxxx
> > >
> > >    Find past Mutual Help topics in the CAA Help Forum
> > > http://www.californiaaviation.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?
> > conf=DCConfID6
> >
> > *****************************************
> > California Aviation Alliance: Mutual Help List
> >
> > To originate a message to the Mutual Help List, address your e-mail to
> > help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, fill in the 'Subject" line and your message
> or
> > use the convenient form at:
> > http://www.californiaaviation.org/post_to_lists.htm
> > Either way, your message will be received by everyone on the list.
> >
> > To respond to someone elses message to this list, simply click on the
> > 'Reply' button on your e-mail program, leaving the 'Subject' line alone.
> > Your response will be received by everyone on the list.
> >
> > To manage your CAA subscriptions, use the CAA: Mail List Administration
> page
> > at  http://californiaaviation.org/cal/index.cfm
> >    Find past Mutual Help topics in the CAA Help Forum
> >
> http://www.californiaaviation.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?conf=DCConfID6
> >
> > *****************************************
> > California Aviation Alliance: Mutual Help List
> >
> > To originate a message to the Mutual Help List, address your e-mail to
> help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, fill in the 'Subject" line and your message or
> use the convenient form at:
> http://www.californiaaviation.org/post_to_lists.htm
> > Either way, your message will be received by everyone on the list.
> >
> > To respond to someone elses message to this list, simply click on the
> 'Reply' button on your e-mail program, leaving the 'Subject' line alone.
> > Your response will be received by everyone on the list.
> >
> > To manage your CAA subscriptions, use the CAA: Mail List Administration
> page at  http://californiaaviation.org/cal/index.cfm
>
>    Find past Mutual Help topics in the CAA Help Forum
> http://www.californiaaviation.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?conf=DCConfID6
>
> *****************************************
> California Aviation Alliance: Mutual Help List
>
> To originate a message to the Mutual Help List, address your e-mail to
> help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, fill in the 'Subject" line and your message or
> use the convenient form at:
> http://www.californiaaviation.org/post_to_lists.htm
> Either way, your message will be received by everyone on the list.
>
> To respond to someone elses message to this list, simply click on the
> 'Reply' button on your e-mail program, leaving the 'Subject' line alone.
> Your response will be received by everyone on the list.
>
> To manage your CAA subscriptions, use the CAA: Mail List Administration page
> at  http://californiaaviation.org/cal/index.cfm
>
>    Find past Mutual Help topics in the CAA Help Forum
> http://www.californiaaviation.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?conf=DCConfID6
>
> *****************************************
> California Aviation Alliance: Mutual Help List
>
> To originate a message to the Mutual Help List, address your e-mail to 
>help@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, fill in the 'Subject" line and your message or 
>use the convenient form at: http://www.californiaaviation.org/post_to_lists.htm
> Either way, your message will be received by everyone on the list.
>
> To respond to someone elses message to this list, simply click on the 'Reply' 
>button on your e-mail program, leaving the 'Subject' line alone.
> Your response will be received by everyone on the list.
>
> To manage your CAA subscriptions, use the CAA: Mail List Administration page 
>at  http://californiaaviation.org/cal/index.cfm

   Find past Mutual Help topics in the CAA Help Forum
http://www.californiaaviation.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?conf=DCConfID6

*****************************************